Responses to Coming changes in impending MX 25 release.

[rambo919]

To me it all actually makes perfect sense.

Much as it irks me to say it SysV has stagnated years ago and pretty much the entire ecosystem expects SystemD and people are surprised when it's not present... it's just the way almost everything has gone.

Regarding X11 vs Wayland.... would it not be better to include a toggle with the installer for the default? Perhaps also a toggle in MX Tweak? It won't really matter all that much as KDE should remember the last used session so it should be easy to set the default after the fact but the operative word is "should". The only default setting in settings is for automatic login.

Both these changes of positioning have been highly predictable for a while now.

I have never and still see no point in using secure boot and 32-kernels probably wont be an issue anymore given the state of hardware in use.... personally neither affects me.

EDIT: in case someone missed it https://mxlinux.org/blog/changes-coming-with-mx-25/

[BV206]

I have one question. Are there any common end user type applications like office, drawing, web browsers, mail, etc. that will only run on systemd, or does the init system not affect most software?

[AVLinux]

I agree as well,

What's sad is when you make a decision like this the finality of it seems to dull a lot of the credit that is due to the MX team and shim maintainers for doing the herculean and unprecedented task they did for so long. It was an incredible feat! Sadly, swimming against the current makes you strong, then it makes you tired and then it becomes impossible. We talk a lot about freedom and choice in the Linux world but 'the people above' make decisions and sooner or later they become the status quo and resistance becomes difficult, exhausting and then futile.. To be clear choice has not been lost as sysv will still be offered but the ability to provide something so unique has been forced to an end and whenever such ends occur in the open source world there is an extra measure of feeling disappointed and a bit disillusioned. Systemd played out, PipeWire played out and Wayland is next, it's not an 'if' it's a 'when' at this point.

Everything has rules and limitations and we're not as free here as we'd like to believe even without corporate overlords. To me these changes in MX despite the best efforts and extremely hard work are a sobering reminder about about how free we are in Linuxdom..

Just my 2 cents as an observer..

[CharlesV]

I have one question. Are there any common end user type applications like office, drawing, web browsers, mail, etc. that will only run on systemd, or does the init system not affect most software?

From what I have seen, the real difference is how things are launched and what they may have required to already be running. (ie services.)

I have encountered some applications that 'require' systemd, (backup applications, online service connections, printer drivers, databases, etc) all of which I have so far been able to get around by creating scripts to launch them. However, talking to support techs about it.. they are adamant the systemd must be run to support their apps. ( yes, I realize these are the unknowing, but some have flat out told me they will not support it unless.)

[CharlesV]

I agree as well,

What's sad is when you make a decision like this the finality of it seems to dull a lot of the credit that is due to the MX team and shim maintainers for doing the herculean and unprecedented task they did for so long. It was an incredible feat! Sadly, swimming against the current makes you strong, then it makes you tired and then it becomes impossible. We talk a lot about freedom and choice in the Linux world but 'the people above' make decisions and sooner or later they become the status quo and resistance becomes difficult, exhausting and then futile.. To be clear choice has not been lost as sysv will still be offered but the ability to provide something so unique has been forced to an end and whenever such ends occur in the open source world there is an extra measure of feeling disappointed and a bit disillusioned. Systemd played out, PipeWire played out and Wayland is next, it's not an 'if' it's a 'when' at this point.

Everything has rules and limitations and we're not as free here as we'd like to believe even without corporate overlords. To me these changes in MX despite the best efforts and extremely hard work are a sobering thought about how free we are in Linuxdom..

Just my 2 cents as an observer..

VERY well said!

[siamhie]

Regarding X11 vs Wayland.... would it not be better to include a toggle with the installer for the default? Perhaps also a toggle in MX Tweak? It won't really matter all that much as KDE should remember the last used session so it should be easy to set the default after the fact but the operative word is "should". The only default setting in settings is for automatic login.

KDE will have Wayland as the default desktop session.
Sounds like XFCE has some work left to be done regarding Wayland support and fluxbox will never be able to use Wayland as a desktop session, so X11 will be the only choice.

[rambo919]

Just my 2 cents as an observer..

Yes. At the end of the day, freedom is not free. You either have to fight for it or maintain it yourself.

We can't all be batman.... we are not even all wealthy enough to even attempt it.

[Gabriel_M]

Well, I've already started using systemd and trying to learn about it.
And in the distant future, I'll have to learn about Wayland.

[rambo919]

Well, I've already started using systemd and trying to learn about it.
And in the distant future, I'll have to learn about Wayland.

Maybe... that war is still ongoing though.... it's going to be a harder fought one than the init one was.... especially since politics got involved early on.... which means it's gonna get real stupid sometimes.

[beardedragon]

Sorry , don't care for KDE. Not looking forward to Wayland in XFCE. Have used Systemd in other distros, all right I guess.