MX Linux Forum

I would also say that snapshots are NOT overrated. I make a snapshot every week and have used them many times.

That's a lot of advice but still doesn't answer my original question. I don't know why you all think I am trying to do something different and if I am in place I don't need to be it's because I followed the info posted here

The OFFICIAL MIGRATION GUIDE https://mxlinux.org/migration/ says:

3) install MX 23 OVER your current installation as you proceed:
a) at the beginning, select to make a “Custom” installation
b) choose the same user name that you used before
c) select to re-use the existing home directory

and that I should be presented with this option
https://mxlinux.org/wp-content/uploads/ ... ration.jpg

If someone can give me an ELI5 to get here, that would be swell.


Just for the record, I have been using Linux as my desktop/ laptop solution since the deprecation of Windows XP and I am currently running 6 linux installs for various and sundry reasons (desktop, laptop, shop desktop, 3 virtual machines) so I feel I kinda got a handle at this point. As for backups, if you read my post you'll see my backups are backed up along with the snapshot to transfer to the new machine.

The reason I have been trying to make this work because if there any vestiges of my current home folder that will be useful after the upgrade it would save a lot of time, so I would like to see what happens using this method. Starting from scratch means a lot user info and customization that I would have to re-input, so anytime saved is great. Plus, it looks like the User Package Installer would be a great help. I recently changed the shop computer to Peppermint from MX19 and it took the better part of day to get things working like I was used to, and that's a much simpler install than my desktop.

Thanks again



Moderator: image changed to link, please read the forum rules, thanks.

Try it if you want to and if you have the necessary experience, but the success rate is about 50%. It will also take substantially longer to accomplish than our recommended method.

Remember.. it is not recommended and not supported.

Eadwine Rose wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:00 pm Remember.. it is not recommended and not supported.

j2mcgreg wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:58 pm Try it if you want to and if you have the necessary experience, but the success rate is about 50%. It will also take substantially longer to accomplish than our recommended method.

You are both responding as if kellyv is talking about this procedure: https://mxlinux.org/wiki/system/upgradi ... nstalling/

But instead they emphasize it's this:

kellyv wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:23 pm I followed the info posted here

The OFFICIAL MIGRATION GUIDE https://mxlinux.org/migration/ says:

3) install MX 23 OVER your current installation as you proceed:
a) at the beginning, select to make a “Custom” installation
b) choose the same user name that you used before
c) select to re-use the existing home directory

and that I should be presented with this option
https://mxlinux.org/wp-content/uploads/ ... ration.jpg

That is the official, supported, recommended way of installing MX Linux from 21 to 23, "A clean install is highly recommended for most users, most easily done by following these steps", where step 3 is

"3) install MX 23 OVER your current installation as you proceed:
a) at the beginning, select to make a “Custom” installation
b) choose the same user name that you used before
c) select to re-use the existing home directory"

https://mxlinux.org/migration/

That official document.

Also, I might add, WHEN talking about the unofficial way of migrating WITHOUT reinstalling (which isn't the above), it's good to warn about it being an expert procedure - but there's nothing inherently bad about doing that, if the user is at a level comfortable of performing such procedures with their OS. Generally (not talking about this instance, but in general) a user might have custom authored their system to such extent that it's no longer near stock MX, and definitely a time saver to perform that procedure instead of installing from scratch. That is not for typical use, or typical home user skill level, but again: WHEN appropriate, it's good to know that it is a realistic option to try. In the actual documentation it is called the "unofficial but well-tested method for experienced users to migrate without re-installation", and "Success is not guaranteed, and some users encounter configuration problems afterwards." That's a balanced view of the procedure, and as I've said previously, I'm very grateful Adrian has taken the time to document that procedure.

@kellyv
Sorry, I misunderstood. You only get presented with option to reuse home, if you first select custom partitioning.

Nokkaelaein wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:17 pm That is the official, supported, recommended way of installing MX Linux from 21 to 23, "A clean install is highly recommended for most users, most easily done by following these steps"

There's a discrepancy between calling something an official, supported way of doing something and the line immediately preceding the given quote about how a clean install is highly recommended. The line immediately preceding it? "Because of the change in the base from Debian 11 (Bullseye) to Debian 12 (Bookworm), there can be no official upgrade option."

So I think there's some confusion surrounding any upgrade process, because even though there's an approach which is "recommended", it's not "official", and in truth not even an "upgrade". I think that's creating some cognitive dissonance.

Personally, I interpret "there can be no official upgrade option" as pretty cut and dried and the subsequent steps, though on the project's website, and with an easy to remember URL, can in no way be considered "official" and thus likely not "supported". Perhaps the wording on the migration page could be revised to make it clear what the official, supported, recommended way actually is and that might clear up some of the confusion regardless of what those steps actually are.

(Side note: I think a lot of folks think of the words "upgrade" and "migration" as interchangeable and, in common parlance, that makes sense. "I had an MX-21 machine. I did some stuff to it. Now I have an MX-23 machine." In this case, the mxlinux.org/migration page is just outlining a method to pave over an existing machine with a new install with some extra steps to keep a list of old packages and preserve the contents under /home. Is this really a migration if you must literally re-install all your old software based on a text file you backed up? It's a philosophical question and I don't think many of us are keen on talking through the Ship of Theseus to answer it. The confusion comes in when there are clearly two different sets of instructions and even the one that doesn't have a big nasty disclaimer attached to it... still has a disclaimer attached to it.)

DukeComposed wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:51 pm There's a discrepancy between calling something an official, supported way of doing something and the line immediately preceding the given quote about how a clean install is highly recommended. The line immediately preceding it? "Because of the change in the base from Debian 11 (Bullseye) to Debian 12 (Bookworm), there can be no official upgrade option."

So I think there's some confusion surrounding any upgrade process, because even though there's an approach which is "recommended", it's not "official", and in truth not even an "upgrade". I think that's creating some cognitive dissonance.

Awh, sorry, I don't follow your logic here, heh :). It is most definitely official and supported.

If it's in the main bar of the official MX Linux website, I assume it's actual official communication?

https://i.imgur.com/bMeLAPX.png
https://mxlinux.org/migration/

And it says:

"Because of the change in the base from Debian 11 (Bullseye) to Debian 12 (Bookworm), there can be no official upgrade option. A clean install is highly recommended for most users, most easily done by following these steps:"

Followed by the actual steps, number three being, "3) install MX 23 OVER your current installation as you proceed"

Note that it indeed says "most easily done by following these steps." This is a clean install, keeping user data in the home directory - and it does a clean install of the actual OS over the previous one. You say this "can in no way be considered "official" and thus likely not "supported"" - but this is literally the official, supported way of doing this. Are you sure you are reading the same page?

Then there's a separate link, clearly separate, described as "There is unofficial but well-tested method for experienced users to migrate without re-installation: consult this Wiki page. Success is not guaranteed, and some users encounter configuration problems afterwards." Note that this description says "There is an unofficial but well-tested method", emphasizing that the said link takes the reader to unofficial instructions (i.e. the instructions on the main Migration page are, in contrast, official.)

Nokkaelaein wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:10 pm If it's in the main bar of the official MX Linux website, I assume it's actual official communication?

Making assumptions is how things get broken in the first place. My point remains: there is a clear contradiction between "there's no official upgrade option" and "here are some steps we recommend". I'm interpreting that the part saying "no official upgrade option" means "no official upgrade option".

DukeComposed wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:50 pm Making assumptions is how things get broken in the first place. My point remains: there is a clear contradiction between "there's no official upgrade option" and "here are some steps we recommend". I'm interpreting that the part saying "no official upgrade option" means "no official upgrade option".

Wah, I sort of get where you are coming from with this (and I wasn't the least bit sarcastic when asking whether you are reading the same page, btw :) I was really puzzled by this), I just think there's a limit to what the "necessary qualifications" for something to be considered official are, hah.

I mean, MX Linux has an FAQ, linked on the main page, I think it's safe to assume that is official, to the extent "official" can be understood in this context, right?

And there's a question, "What’s the best way to upgrade from one version of MX to another?" The answer: "Instructions for migration of different MX versions can be found on the Migration page of the MX Community website." (Links to https://mxlinux.org/migration/ ) - where it says there is no official upgrade option, and "A clean install is highly recommended for most users, most easily done by following these steps" ... followed by the steps for a clean install of the OS.

I understand where you are coming from with this, but personally I think this goes into the territory of things being communicated in a certain way, and whether the actual text communicates what was intended to be communicated. I choose to believe these texts contain what they were intending to communicate :), and as they are the official MX Linux materials themselves, it's okay to assume they are official, eh. If the MX project has indeed intended to communicate something else (than what actually reads in the text) that's of course a problem, and the texts should be changed. Maybe a rewrite wouldn't hurt in any case if it's bringing up ambiguity like this?

But yeah, I note and understand your point of view, and I guess that's enough about that xD