MX Linux Forum

Posted: **Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:09 pm**

I have a couple of questions on a new install of MX 19.1 that I haven’t been able to find answers for.

For the initial user account that is created during a clean install I used a personal name and I used the standard spelling which begins with a capital letter. There were no problems or warnings about using a capital letter for this user account name.

For the second user I tried using a name that begins with a capital letter, but now there is a warning that capital letters can’t be used in a user name. So now my first user account name begins with a capital letter, but my second user account name is all lower case.

Searching the User Manual and help files and online yielded nothing definitive about this, and it seems that it may depend on the developer.

1) Can anyone tell me if my first user account with the capital letter is possibly going to cause problems down the road?
2) If not, is it possible to add a second user name using a capital letter?

I don’t think that this is related, but when I log out of either account my internal drives do not get “un-mounted”, which means that when I log back in using the second account I can’t access any extra drives unless I manually un-mount them first. If I “restart” my computer instead of just logging out then the extra internal partitions and drives get un-mounted and I can then access them without having to do anything special. I have checked the box in MX Tweak that “Enables mounting of internal drives by non-root users”.

3) Is this the normal expected behavior or is my user name with the “capital letter” possibly causing a problem?

It would seem that “log out” would mean “log out”, but in my current setup “log out” means “mostly, kinda, sorta logged out”.

Any help is appreciated.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 1:42 am**

I've been using capitals in my user accounts for a long time, and I haven't encountered any issues. The installer has allowed capitals for a long time, even since before I started playing around with it last year, so there shouldn't be any issues for ordinary everyday usage. More elaborate setups, such as a seamless remote login to a nuclear reactor UNIX system with software from 1999, that requires lower-case to ensure the core temperature is below melting point, then you may run into some issues.

Regarding your internal drives, I'll leave that for a more seasoned Linux dev to explain. Is this also occurring with external (eg. USB) drives?

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:46 am**

IIRC, when gvfs mounts (which is what thunar uses), the mounts are stored on a per-user basis under /media/$USER/mountpoint. I would have to check a little closer, but it may be that only the particular user has write permissions on that folder, although I would think any user could read.

you can override this behavior by defining common mountpoints (say under /media which is what I use) for your internal partitions by setting up entries in the /etc/fstab. disk-manager can help with that (preinstalled) if you aren't up to speed on fstab editing/creation.

you could also set up a script to unmount all your partitions and set it up to run at logout. Xfce has that sort of option in the Session & Startup "autostart" area. We use it to run the logout sound set by mx-system-sounds when that feature is enabled.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:12 am**

as for the user name, I see that mx-user DOES filter down to non-capitals for the username validation. We will have to check that.

to work around that for now, use "adduser" from the terminal instead of mx-user.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:03 pm**

Thanks AK-47. I was just about to log in and check on some things at Three Mile Island, and now I will be sure to use my “lower case” account.

And dolphin_oracle, I was afraid you would say that. I have now read enough on the various Linux Forums to see that there are many dedicated devs like yourself out there who really are helpful and they’re awesome in what they do.

But…..I’m also beginning to understand why Bill Gates is now a billionaire.

How long has Linux been in use as a desktop operating system – and I have to use a glorified DOS prompt if I want to add a new user with a capital letter in their user name?

And…..I replaced two good working versions of Windows 7 with MX Linux in different multiboot rigs -- only to find that in order to access my user data that is outside of the limited view of the token “home” folder (or is that “Home” folder) that I need to “learn to code”.

Yes, as explained in my original post, I can access my data when I re-boot instead of just logging out – but again, how many years has Linux been in worldwide use?

I would rather pay for a working operating system than use my valuable time learning how to get a “free” operating system to do the most basic computing tasks. My time is not free, so I’ll just keep using my Windows 7 installs until they die completely.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:20 pm**

WARRIOR wrote: ↑Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:03 pm
How long has Linux been in use as a desktop operating system – and I have use a glorified DOS prompt if I want to add a new user with a capital letter in their user name?

you shouldn't have to, but it is a bug in our mx-user app which I'm sure will get fixed soon now that you have reported it. Its not one that's been mentioned before, and a hold over from a time where lowercase was the way to go.

And…..I replaced two good working versions of Windows 7 with MX Linux in different multiboot rigs -- only to find that in order to access my user data that is outside of the limited view of the token “home” folder (or is that “Home” folder) that I need to “learn to code”.

I don't think you've spent quite enough looking around if you think you need to code to do things outside the home folder. Outside the home folder is restricted, sure, but editing a text file or entering a password is not that hard.

Yes, as explained in my original post, I can access my data when I re-boot instead of just logging out – but again, how many years has Linux been in worldwide use?

long time, and as I said, you don't need to reboot, you just need to set things up inside the long-established linux model. Its different from Windows, and Windows is different from Linux.

I would rather pay for a working operating system than use my valuable time learning how to get a “free” operating system to do the most basic computing tasks. My time is not free, so I’ll just keep using my Windows 7 installs until they die completely.

I'm a firm believer in using what I pay for. I'm also a firm believer in linux as a desktop operating system.

Have fun!

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:20 pm**

There are obviously many gifted programmers that make Linux “work”, but there are also many people like myself that don’t have that special “eye-hand” coordination that makes a terminal window come to life.

Can I edit a simple text file? Yes.

Do I enjoy it? No.

And that’s the difference between myself and the average Linux user. If you want Linux to be developed for that gifted 10 or 15 percent, or whatever it is, you’re doing fine already. If you hope to expand Linux outside of that 10 or 15 percent bubble it won’t happen with instructions about how to edit the xxx file in the xxx directory with the xxx program in the xxx repository.

I’m just sayin.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:35 pm**

WARRIOR wrote: ↑Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:20 pm There are obviously many gifted programmers that make Linux “work”, but there are also many people like myself that don’t have that special “eye-hand” coordination that makes a terminal window come to life.

Can I edit a simple text file? Yes.

Do I enjoy it? No.

And that’s the difference between myself and the average Linux user. If you want Linux to be developed for that gifted 10 or 15 percent, or whatever it is, you’re doing fine already. If you hope to expand Linux outside of that 10 or 15 percent bubble it won’t happen with instructions about how to edit the xxx file in the xxx directory with the xxx program in the xxx repository.

I’m just sayin.

You need to take the time to study the manual and explore and get to know your new operating system. MX Linux, like its predecessor MEPIS, is famous for including GUI (graphical user interface) tools for most things that in other distros woyld require hand-editing of text-based configuration files or running arcane commands in a terminal. However, it's still Linux so there will always be some manual configurations that have to be made and commands given within a terminal. That's just the nature of Linux, as it was with the Unix its based on or patterned after.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:48 pm**

Most users of Linux aren't really concerned with world domination. Use whatever pleases you.
True in the Windows world as in Linux.

Thanks for reporting the bug.
Stay safe in 2020.

Posted: **Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:08 pm**

WARRIOR wrote: ↑Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:03 pm How long has Linux been in use as a desktop operating system – and I have use a glorified DOS prompt if I want to add a new user with a capital letter in their user name?

It is an old, well established, and well accepted convention from UNIX that lower case usernames are preferable. It's not necessary, and therefore not enforced, but for cross-platform use, users may be better off with lower case usernames. https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... ive#235086

My own preference is the established convention. It is good.

Posted: **Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:00 pm**

Thanks for the responses and for not flaming me to oblivion.

If I could reply in a general sense without quoting everyone I would like to say the following.

I’m glad that the goal of Linux has never been “world domination”, that’s part of what makes it attractive.

Before I ever posted my question about “lower case” user names I had already spent many hours searching this forum and the MX help files and FAQ and other Linux forums and doing general online searches – and I do mean many hours – in “learning my operating system”. All to come up with “nothing definitive”.

A user name is probably the most basic and simplest of all things one can do on a personal computer – because it’s mandatory for everyone. Just the fact that I am the first one to ask about this “feature” in MX that does not allow a second user name to be added with a capital letter unless the terminal is used speaks volumes about who is currently using MX Linux, and it’s those that excel in “a lower case terminal environment”. There is nothing wrong with this or with the original “Unix Model”, but I hope that you will see that there is also nothing wrong with my observation as it applies in this current day.

The final thing that I have to add is a general thought about “gifted persons”. The most gifted people in any field are usually not the best teachers – because what they do just comes naturally and they don’t have to think about what they do – they just “do it”.

My questions and comments come from someone that is “not gifted” in a terminal environment, so when the answer to my question about not being able to access my external drives came back to me as a three paragraph answer with references to “gvfs mounts” that I can easily manipulate - I don’t consider this “learning my operating system". I consider this “learning to code”.

And it’s not that I don’t want to do it, it’s that it’s just not my gifting.

Thanks again for all the replies.

Posted: **Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:51 pm**

There's no "gift" involved in learning to use console commands. It's a matter of research, reading documentation, etc. to learn how they work, then just learning and experience after that. The only gift that might be involved is one of attitude. People who've convinced themselves ahead of time that they can't use the command-line are going to have a harder time than those who just dive in and start learning it without thinking about it too much. It's really just another tool.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:04 am**

I just have a collection of useful commands pasted into a text file that I can call up any time.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:03 am**

Got it!

Thanks to all.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:18 am**

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Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:37 am**

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Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:53 pm**

It's totally disorganised, and probably not so applicable for MX, since it's a mish mash of arch/pacman stuff, plus ad-hoc stuff like commands for manually adding vboxusers group and setting up shared folder in virtualbox , creating symlinks, etc. It's more to do with the fact that I multiboot many distros and may forget relevant commands needed for each.

Plus, some internet radio url links for my favourite stations because for some distros, the default nomenclature for radio stations in lollypop doesn't work.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:19 pm**

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Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:31 pm**

asqwerth wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:04 am I just have a collection of useful commands pasted into a text file that I can call up any time.

It's a personal cheat sheet. Doesn't everybody do that? It's like taking notes while studying.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:52 pm**

komer wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:37 am
asqwerth wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:04 am I just have a collection of useful commands pasted into a text file that I can call up any time.
Could you, please, share that text file?

Mine is fairly organized. I have a personal "bin" directory in my path (actually /scratch/bin/ to which is a symlink at /home/username/bin that points to it) where I keep personal shell scripts. One of those shell scripts is "m" (/scratch/bin/m) that brings up a personal menu in the terminal.

Code: Select all

#!/bin/sh
more /scratch/bin/menu.txt

/scratch/bin/menu.txt is just a text file that I maintain with vim (or use any text editor). It's an attachment with this post. Lots of ancient stuff because I never delete from it, just add or edit.

Also, I keep a text file on my desktop just for a scratch pad. It's named Notes.txt and I'll attach that also. Hopefully nothing secret in there.

Also, FYI, you can also type "help" into a terminal and pull up a very useful list of shell commands. I think this is pretty universal across versions.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:14 pm**

WARRIOR wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:03 am Got it!
Thanks to all.

Don't take this personally, but I've long held (40 years or so) that most computer users don't know how to use their computers. They are enslaved by their operating system (thank you Microsoft and Apple) where the user can point, click, use application programs, and develop myriads of bad computing habits along the way, but are often unable so solve what should be rudimentary issues that invariably arise.

These bad computing habits transfer with the user when they try a different operating system and are very frustrating for the user. People who use computers would be well served by learning how to use computers, but Microsoft and Apple have made it increasingly difficult over the years to do meaningful work from the shell from which the power of the operating system, shell, and languages can be unleashed.

I would prefer to see an installer that encourages users to use lowercase user names, with a brief explanation, and require the user to check a box to deviate from the convention. I understand the slight security advantage by allowing increased variability in usernames. Some financial sites require complex usernames (upper and lower cases + numbers + symbols). I'm not an MX developer and I'll be pleased whichever direction they go on this.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:49 pm**

The terminal keeps a history of the commands you used, you can up arrow to scroll through it and find a command and press enter to use it again.
You can edit the .bash_history file (a plain text file in your user directory) to remove commands.

I usually go through mine after using the terminal for a while and remove duplicates and commands I will not use again.

Posted: **Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:15 pm**

Post deleted by author.

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