MX Linux Forum

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 3:03 pm**

Hello,

I am now finished to migrate my household from windows to MX Linux and it seems like all is stable, more or less. A few problems persists (cant change wallpaper directory for screensaver etc.) But we can ignore that.

Long story short: I had quite the work cut out for me for these last weeks so I now stumbled, late I know, upon the release cycle for Debian Stable. So LTS should go on until 2028 so am I "safe" until then? Or "should" I completely reinstall the new "MX 25" in june 25 with Debian 13? Did I even understand that correctly?

Whats for example with updates for "Proton/Wine" on Steam? Do I need to go with Debian 13 for newest updates? Or with an office PC which uses mostly Libre Office, Firefox, Videoplayers and an printer? Do I need the newest Debian version or can I get security updates also through the LTS channel?

Quite frankly: I am tired. I just want my PCs to function and to update the least times possible.

So for function, stability and security reasons: "should" I go with the newest Debian or should I wait an year so it isnt "cutting edge" anymore or can I simply skip one Debian version?

Thank you in advance for your answers. Have a nice day.

EDIT. Here is one of my QSI...:

Code: Select all

Snapshot created on: 20250318_1840
System:
  Kernel: 6.12.17-1-liquorix-amd64 [6.12-22~mx23ahs] arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 12.2.0 parameters: audit=0
    intel_pstate=disable amd_pstate=disable BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-6.12.17-1-liquorix-amd64
    root=UUID=<filter> ro nomodeset splash quiet
  Desktop: Xfce v: 4.20.0 tk: Gtk v: 3.24.38 info: xfce4-panel wm: xfwm v: 4.20.0 vt: 7
    dm: LightDM v: 1.32.0 Distro: MX-23.6_x64 Libretto March 18  2025 base: Debian GNU/Linux 12
    (bookworm)
Machine:
  Type: Desktop System: Gigabyte product: Z690 AORUS PRO v: -CF serial: <superuser required>
  Mobo: Gigabyte model: Z690 AORUS PRO serial: <superuser required> UEFI: American Megatrends
    LLC. v: F8e date: 03/14/2022
CPU:
  Info: model: 12th Gen Intel Core i7-12700K bits: 64 type: MST AMCP arch: Alder Lake gen: core 12
    level: v3 note: check built: 2021+ process: Intel 7 (10nm ESF) family: 6 model-id: 0x97 (151)
    stepping: 2 microcode: 0x38
  Topology: cpus: 1x cores: 12 mt: 8 tpc: 2 st: 4 threads: 20 smt: enabled cache: L1: 1024 KiB
    desc: d-4x32 KiB, 8x48 KiB; i-8x32 KiB, 4x64 KiB L2: 12 MiB desc: 8x1.2 MiB, 1x2 MiB L3: 25 MiB
    desc: 1x25 MiB
  Speed (MHz): avg: 1588 high: 3601 min/max: 800/3601 boost: enabled scaling:
    driver: acpi-cpufreq governor: ondemand cores: 1: 2447 2: 3540 3: 1270 4: 800 5: 1585 6: 2200
    7: 800 8: 800 9: 800 10: 800 11: 924 12: 800 13: 3601 14: 800 15: 900 16: 1600 17: 1200
    18: 3601 19: 2400 20: 900 bogomips: 144383
  Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
  Vulnerabilities:
  Type: gather_data_sampling status: Not affected
  Type: itlb_multihit status: Not affected
  Type: l1tf status: Not affected
  Type: mds status: Not affected
  Type: meltdown status: Not affected
  Type: mmio_stale_data status: Not affected
  Type: reg_file_data_sampling mitigation: Clear Register File
  Type: retbleed status: Not affected
  Type: spec_rstack_overflow status: Not affected
  Type: spec_store_bypass mitigation: Speculative Store Bypass disabled via prctl
  Type: spectre_v1 mitigation: usercopy/swapgs barriers and __user pointer sanitization
  Type: spectre_v2 mitigation: Enhanced / Automatic IBRS; IBPB: conditional; RSB filling;
    PBRSB-eIBRS: SW sequence; BHI: BHI_DIS_S
  Type: srbds status: Not affected
  Type: tsx_async_abort status: Not affected
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel AlderLake-S GT1 vendor: Gigabyte driver: N/A alternate: i915, xe bus-ID: 00:02.0
    chip-ID: 8086:4680 class-ID: 0300
  Device-2: NVIDIA GA104 [GeForce RTX 3070 Lite Hash Rate] vendor: Micro-Star MSI driver: nvidia
    v: 535.216.03 non-free: 530.xx+ status: current (as of 2023-03) arch: Ampere code: GAxxx
    process: TSMC n7 (7nm) built: 2020-22 pcie: gen: 4 speed: 16 GT/s lanes: 16 bus-ID: 01:00.0
    chip-ID: 10de:2488 class-ID: 0300
  Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.21.1.7 with: Xwayland v: 22.1.9 compositor: xfwm v: 4.20.0
    driver: X: loaded: nvidia unloaded: fbdev,modesetting,nouveau,vesa alternate: nv gpu: nvidia
    display-ID: :0.0 screens: 1
  Screen-1: 0 s-res: 3840x2160 s-dpi: 96 s-size: 1017x572mm (40.04x22.52")
    s-diag: 1167mm (45.94")
  Monitor-1: DP-0 res: 3840x2160 hz: 60 dpi: 157 size: 621x341mm (24.45x13.43")
    diag: 708mm (27.89") modes: N/A
  API: OpenGL v: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 535.216.03 renderer: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070/PCIe/SSE2
    direct-render: Yes
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel Alder Lake-S HD Audio vendor: Gigabyte driver: snd_hda_intel bus-ID: 1-12.2:8
    v: kernel alternate: snd_soc_avs,snd_sof_pci_intel_tgl chip-ID: 1532:0504 class-ID: 0300
    bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:7ad0 class-ID: 0403
  Device-2: NVIDIA GA104 High Definition Audio vendor: Micro-Star MSI driver: snd_hda_intel
    v: kernel pcie: gen: 4 speed: 16 GT/s lanes: 16 bus-ID: 01:00.1 chip-ID: 10de:228b class-ID: 0403
  Device-3: Razer USA Kraken 7.1 Chroma type: USB driver: hid-generic,snd-usb-audio,usbhid
  Device-4: Giga-Byte USB Audio type: USB driver: hid-generic,snd-usb-audio,usbhid bus-ID: 1-4:2
    chip-ID: 0414:a012 class-ID: 0300
  API: ALSA v: k6.12.17-1-liquorix-amd64 status: kernel-api tools: alsamixer,amixer
  Server-1: PipeWire v: 1.0.0 status: active with: 1: pipewire-pulse status: active
    2: wireplumber status: active 3: pipewire-alsa type: plugin 4: pw-jack type: plugin
    tools: pactl,pw-cat,pw-cli,wpctl
Network:
  Device-1: Intel Ethernet I225-V vendor: Gigabyte driver: igc v: kernel pcie: gen: 2 speed: 5 GT/s
    lanes: 1 port: N/A bus-ID: 03:00.0 chip-ID: 8086:15f3 class-ID: 0200
  IF: eth0 state: up speed: 1000 Mbps duplex: full mac: <filter>
  Device-2: Intel Wi-Fi 6 AX200 driver: iwlwifi v: kernel modules: wl pcie: gen: 2 speed: 5 GT/s
    lanes: 1 bus-ID: 04:00.0 chip-ID: 8086:2723 class-ID: 0280
  IF: wlan0 state: down mac: <filter>
Bluetooth:
  Device-1: Intel AX200 Bluetooth type: USB driver: btusb v: 0.8 bus-ID: 1-14:9 chip-ID: 8087:0029
    class-ID: e001
  Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 1 state: up address: <filter> bt-v: 3.0 lmp-v: 5.2
    sub-v: 2184 hci-v: 5.2 rev: 2184
  Info: acl-mtu: 1021:4 sco-mtu: 96:6 link-policy: rswitch sniff link-mode: peripheral accept
    service-classes: rendering, capturing, object transfer, audio, telephony
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 3.64 TiB used: 2.11 TiB (58.0%)
  SMART Message: Unable to run smartctl. Root privileges required.
  ID-1: /dev/nvme0n1 maj-min: 259:1 vendor: Samsung model: SSD 980 PRO 1TB size: 931.51 GiB
    block-size: physical: 512 B logical: 512 B speed: 63.2 Gb/s lanes: 4 type: SSD serial: <filter>
    rev: 5B2QGXA7 temp: 27.9 C scheme: GPT
  ID-2: /dev/nvme1n1 maj-min: 259:0 vendor: Samsung model: SSD 980 PRO 1TB size: 931.51 GiB
    block-size: physical: 512 B logical: 512 B speed: 63.2 Gb/s lanes: 4 type: SSD serial: <filter>
    rev: 5B2QGXA7 temp: 27.9 C scheme: GPT
  ID-3: /dev/sda maj-min: 8:0 vendor: Seagate model: ST2000DM008-2UB102 size: 1.82 TiB
    block-size: physical: 4096 B logical: 512 B speed: 6.0 Gb/s type: HDD rpm: 7200 serial: <filter>
    rev: 0001 scheme: GPT
Partition:
  ID-1: / raw-size: 279.38 GiB size: 273.93 GiB (98.05%) used: 24.19 GiB (8.8%) fs: ext4
    dev: /dev/nvme1n1p2 maj-min: 259:4
  ID-2: /boot/efi raw-size: 256 MiB size: 252 MiB (98.46%) used: 274 KiB (0.1%) fs: vfat
    dev: /dev/nvme1n1p1 maj-min: 259:3
  ID-3: /home raw-size: 651.88 GiB size: 640.58 GiB (98.27%) used: 66.89 GiB (10.4%) fs: ext4
    dev: /dev/nvme1n1p3 maj-min: 259:5
Swap:
  Kernel: swappiness: 15 (default 60) cache-pressure: 100 (default)
  ID-1: swap-1 type: file size: 6 GiB used: 0 KiB (0.0%) priority: -2 file: /swap/swap
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 24.5 C mobo: N/A gpu: nvidia temp: 29 C
  Fan Speeds (RPM): N/A gpu: nvidia fan: 0%
Repos:
  Packages: 2617 pm: dpkg pkgs: 2602 libs: 1417 tools: apt,apt-get,aptitude,nala,synaptic pm: rpm
    pkgs: 0 pm: flatpak pkgs: 15
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/debian-stable-updates.list
    1: deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ bookworm-updates main contrib non-free non-free-firmware
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/debian.list
    1: deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ bookworm main contrib non-free non-free-firmware
    2: deb http://security.debian.org/debian-security/ bookworm-security main contrib non-free non-free-firmware
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/mx.list
    1: deb http://ftp.halifax.rwth-aachen.de/mxlinux/packages/mx/repo/ bookworm main non-free
    2: deb http://ftp.halifax.rwth-aachen.de/mxlinux/packages/mx/repo/ bookworm ahs
Info:
  Processes: 420 Uptime: 1m wakeups: 1 Memory: 31.13 GiB used: 2.09 GiB (6.7%) Init: SysVinit
  v: 3.06 runlevel: 5 default: graphical tool: systemctl Compilers: gcc: 12.2.0 alt: 12
  Client: shell wrapper v: 5.2.15-release inxi: 3.3.26
Boot Mode: UEFI

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 3:06 pm**

We are going to need your computer’s complete profile before we can proceed, so you need to post the output from the QSI utility. The Quick System Info (QSI) utility is located in MX Tools and its output is automatically formatted for use here in the forum. Run the QSI utility, click “Copy for Forum” at the bottom and then just paste it here in your thread.
Forum Rules

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 3:16 pm**

So I edited my QSI in. As you can guess out of my first sentences of my topic its just an qeustion about update cycle so I didnt think we need an QSI for an qeustion thats not specifically pc oriented is.
And I am not "so new" here anymore and posted my QSI like an dear little boy in almost all of my other topics.
But rules are rules... *sigh* Sorry for my rant but in my workplace I too have more coworkers who want to work "like the book" but dont even want to consider to think about an case where its more efficient to not work "like the book"...

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 3:55 pm**

The simple answer is that it's up to you. You'll get all the updates, security or otherwise, as long as MX-23 is supported. Additionally, you'll be able to get application updates thanks to our outstanding devs who work hard at providing updated programs for the Debian/MX base, even if they aren't provided from upstream.

Bottom line -- if it was me, I'd take the time to get fully familiar and comfortable with MX and if/when the time comes you think you need to upgrade to a later version, the Community will be here to help. Keep in mind that I'm an "it ain't broke so it don't need fixin'" type and feel no need to be running the latest and greatest. I'm still running MX-19 and am perfectly happy with it. JMO. YMMV.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:03 pm**

MX 25 won't be coming out immediately after Debian 13. It takes no little time for us to rebuild all our extra, non-Debian packages, and then to test and fix any problems with our ISOs. We don't have any bots or AI to help us with that.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:08 pm**

Thanks for your answer uncle mark.

So I am too the type of guy where I dont see the need to fix something when its still functioning. Glad you answered on it.

When you say you use still MX-19 do you surf in the internet with it? Is it still "safe and stable" for you? Whats with working with libre office and/or looking Videos through Firefox or with an mp4, MPEG or Wave file? All stable and functioning? Do you still get security updates for it? Do I even need security updates with Linux... hehe so many questions...

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:19 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 3:03 pm Long story short: I had quite the work cut out for me for these last weeks so I now stumbled, late I know, upon the release cycle for Debian Stable. So LTS should go on until 2028 so am I "safe" until then? Or "should" I completely reinstall the new "MX 25" in june 25 with Debian 13? Did I even understand that correctly?

I don't know what you do or don't understand. You "should" review the docs, starting with https://mxlinux.org/release-cycle/ and the timeline of support given on https://mxlinux.org/previous-releases/ . The MX team is currently working on the next version on top of the forthcoming release of Debian Trixie this June-ish. MX-25 will then be released sometime after that, date TBD.

And, before you ask, there's a migration page and in-place upgrades are not recommended or supported. https://mxlinux.org/migration/

If you have to put MX on something right now, committing to MX-23 is fine since it will keep getting updates for a while. Personally, I'm trying to hold off on reinstalling anything until MX-25 and this has the general result of making me feel itchy. I have an old MX-21 system I use that's working just fine. It will likely get updated later this year and plans have already begun for what that process will entail.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:30 pm**

Thank you too for your answer Stevo,

Yes I thought about that too although just briefly but yes it is amazing what you guys are doing for the Linux community to provide us 0815 PC users with an simple and stable OS is not an easy task. And it requires time and effort to do all the work so I understand it that after an Debian release it will take time for an new MX release.

So another few qeustions: do I need to do something when I want to use the LTS Support until june 2028? Change repo or something? Do I get "only" security updates after june 2026? Or also stability/function related updates through LTS?

And sorry for all these qeustions... I only want to more "know" how all of these "updates" functioning.

Thank you too DukeComposed for your answer.

I already red all the 3 links and I just want to further ask here to generally clarify the function of for example "LTS" and updates in general. One further qeustion in that regard: when an new Debian stable is released do all the software developers for example Firefox or steam (proton/wine) stop their work for software development on Debian 12 and only concentrate on Debian 13 or would software function also on Debian 12 when it functions on Debian 13 (like windows xp games still functioning on windows 10)?

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:03 pm**

I don't think it's recommended to use an outdated distro (MX-19) for the internet.

A few relevant links, the first one Ninja'd by Duke:
https://mxlinux.org/previous-releases/
https://wiki.debian.org/LTS
viewtopic.php?p=661709#p661709 Older, question relevancy
viewtopic.php?p=781524#p781524 In a pinch, maybe.

Some people like to wait until the first point release becomes available, e.g. 25.1.

Cheers!

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:22 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:30 pm I already red all the 3 links and I just want to further ask here to generally clarify the function of for example "LTS" and updates in general. One further qeustion in that regard: when an new Debian stable is released do all the software developers for example Firefox or steam (proton/wine) stop their work for software development on Debian 12 and only concentrate on Debian 13 or would software function also on Debian 12 when it functions on Debian 13 (like windows xp games still functioning on windows 10)?

The LTS comes from Debian itself. IIRC the MX support position is current version and one major version back. At this time that's MX 23 and all releases of MX 21. MX 19 is best effort as no bug fix/feature extension work plan is underway @MX Linux. Security updates would come from Debian only.

More official verbiage on LTS from Debian https://wiki.debian.org/DebianReleases

Check into the MX app User Installed Packages for capturing your apps and installing them on the new installation. It does have some limits:

Flatpacks - not covered

Apimage - not covered

SNAPS - not covered

Anything 'installed' via copying, ie, not through 'apt install <program_name>' or a process that spawns it.

Additionally, set up Timeshift on the machine you intend to migrate, and most importantly, TEST IT ONCE, TEST IT AGAIN! <1>

If you have an old but capable PC that can host the same disks as your main PC, it could be a 'rehearsal stage' for your migration. A second purpose is to test your Timeshift restores. Not the same physical disks, just similarly sized stand-ins of a kind.

1) I was an enterprise email admin during the Enron era. Quite a few people lost their jobs due to backup failures (of key subpoenaed execs' mailbox content).

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:35 pm**

Thank you too MXRobo for your answer.

So I red through the links and what I get was atleast this: That after the supported time (for mx 23 the end is June 26) we don't get updates for the MXTools or any MX related OS Software, or? So for me as an 0815 PC users when I want an stable and fully supported OS I need to get MX25 before June 26, right?

So LTS won't cut it when I stumble over problems related to "unsupported" Software (MX23 after june 26)?

Thank you too for your answer FullScale4Me.

Thanks for your advise. But I am the type of guy who installs an completely new OS over the previous one and then installs the necessary software for printers, games etc. One after another. I think, for stability reasons that's better for me. Because I am inexperienced and don't want to solve ugly problems. So I will most likely not use something from the mx tools when it comes to install an completely new OS.

I will simply back all data on my rusty ntfs hdd USB drive and copy them later back over.

So my qeustion above seems to be answered by you. But is "support" also intended as in Software updates? Or "only" forum support for MX related software and OS?

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:41 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:30 pm I already red all the 3 links and I just want to further ask here to generally clarify the function of for example "LTS" and updates in general.

LTS is a little misleading since it's not a software designation, it's an administrative decision made by a software developer. The Debian team generally promotes stability and chooses LTS kernels as the basis for their releases. Just because an OS uses an LTS kernel, though, doesn't mean that all software in that operating system has the same support schedule.

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:30 pm when an new Debian stable is released do all the software developers for example Firefox or steam (proton/wine) stop their work for software development on Debian 12

I think you're ascribing far too much coordination among disparate software development teams. As a guideline, only some software supports new OSes on release by coordinating with the OS -- this is largely the work of port/package maintainers who volunteer their time working on the OS. Other software projects wait until the OS ships and then start working to adapt their product to it. Firefox is run by Mozilla. Steam is run by Valve. Mozilla and Valve do not set their watches by when Debian ships something (or Fedora or Manjaro or Deepin or Zorin or...). Even for a project like Firefox, Linux use is a relatively small percentage of its user base. It's largely the responsibility of the package maintainers to ensure compatibility of an application with the OS.

This is one of the reasons why a lot of Debian packages are relatively old versions of software that have newer versions available on the developer's website. A bunch of stuff changes under the hood between major releases. Often, developers will update their dependencies to use a new library that the old Debian didn't have. Debian unstable might have the new library, and the new version of the program, but it's not guaranteed that those new packages won't conflict with something on the old Debian. I think most people go through a phase where they discover Debian's different branches and try to get clever about mixing and matching packages between them. That phase usually ends after one apt-get too many trashes an important system package and the OS has to get reinstalled.

To answer the question, developers rarely keep writing software for old versions of OSes. But more to the point, in Linux and other free and open source projects, the port and package maintainers are the ones who take the responsibility of getting things like Firefox and Steam to run, on any version of the OS.

Edit: typos

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:59 pm**

Thanks again for your answer and more detailed explanation DukeComposed,

It helped me to understand a lot.

So the "package maintainers" are the "MX Packaging/Repo" team in our OS case?

When I try to visualise all the work that has to be done by all of the development team I seem to be looking in an near endless abyss...

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 6:17 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:59 pm So the "package maintainers" are the "MX Packaging/Repo" team in our OS case?

Debian packages are maintained by Debian maintainers. MX packages are maintained by the MX devs.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 6:35 pm**

Thank you again DukeComposed.

So I think I am too worrisome when it comes to these things... I now have installed MX Linux on almost all of our PC's (just one windows 10 laptop for "emergency") in our household and we will now simply try to use them for our everyday life. I need to be somewhat up to date when it comes to new version releases but as I am an "it ain't broke, it won't need fixing" type of guy I think I will only upgrade when it really needs to be done. That would be some months before june 28 when Debian 12 doesn't become security updates anymore at it latest. Or something like Firefox or libre office are bugged and cant be used with the new version of the MX OS before June 2028...

Thank you all for your answers.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:14 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 6:35 pm That would be some months before june 28 when Debian 12 doesn't become security updates anymore

Firefox or libre office are bugged and cant be used with the new version of the MX OS before June 2028...

Debian 12 bookworm doesn't fall out of mainstream support until June of 2026. It's unlikely that the Firefox package is ever going to stop working on a given release of MX Linux. The practical issue is that, eventually, patched versions of Firefox and everything else will stop getting published for that release. That won't break Firefox per se, but it will make using it, for example, for online banking a bad idea. Some folks still keep unsupported OSes around purely because their packages are out of date.

Some software, like LibreOffice, doesn't typically influence how safe you are online. You can keep using it to write term papers and print flyers for yard sales on your local printer for years after a new version gets released by the LibreOffice team.

Web, e-mail, and other communications platforms are numbers one, two, and three in terms of importance of staying current. In my opinion, always keep Firefox and SSH up to date. If a utility I only run locally like Kdenlive or Lutris or VLC is out of date, this is less of a catastrophe. My MP3s and Ogg Vorbis files will still play on MX-21 after it falls out of support later this year and I am not worried about that.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:53 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 4:08 pm Thanks for your answer uncle mark.

So I am too the type of guy where I dont see the need to fix something when its still functioning. Glad you answered on it.

When you say you use still MX-19 do you surf in the internet with it? Is it still "safe and stable" for you? Whats with working with libre office and/or looking Videos through Firefox or with an mp4, MPEG or Wave file? All stable and functioning? Do you still get security updates for it? Do I even need security updates with Linux... hehe so many questions...

My continued use of MX-19 is not recommended, but I have no qualms about it. Linux in and of itself is secure by design, and is nowhere near as vulnerable to compromise as is Windows. My point was simply to let you know that even using an outdated, unsupported version is -- for me -- not a concern. Linux has made me unafraid of using my computer, and freed me from the constant vigilance I once had to maintain. Use and enjoy your computer, and rest assured that while there are no guarantees, the chances of being "infected" or compromised in any conventional sense are infinitesimal. I haven't had any issues with any of the applications or use cases you mentioned either.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm**

Thanks again for clarification DukeComposed.

So your advice for safely using Firefox for example for online banking is to upgrade to the newer MX OS version before it falls out of mainstream support?

So I misunderstood and the MX devs won't package new Firefox updates for the last two main MX OS releases? The updates will stop at june 26 for MX 23 except LTS for Kernel security stuff?

---

Also thanks for your opinion again uncle Mark.

It seems like for me I worry too much?... hehe
Its precisely because I am coming fresh from windows that I still have this vigilance what drives me to ask this kind of qeustions...

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 8:32 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm
Also thanks for your opinion again uncle Mark.

It seems like for me I worry too much?... hehe
Its precisely because I am coming fresh from windows that I still have this vigilance what drives me to ask this kind of qeustions...

Understood. We see it all the time with new adopters coming over from Windows. You'll notice there is no such thing as an anti-virus application (in any conventional sense) for Linux. There's a reason for that.

Enjoy carefree computing.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 8:37 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm So your advice for safely using Firefox for example for online banking is to upgrade to the newer MX OS version before it falls out of mainstream support?

So I misunderstood and the MX devs won't package new Firefox updates for the last two main MX OS releases? The updates will stop at june 26 for MX 23

When MX-23 goes out of support, it'll be documented and there will be an announcement made. Same should also hold for MX-21 and that's expected to happen later this year.

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm It seems like for me I worry too much?...

Yes.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 9:36 pm**

uncle mark wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 8:32 pm
Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm
Also thanks for your opinion again uncle Mark.

It seems like for me I worry too much?... hehe
Its precisely because I am coming fresh from windows that I still have this vigilance what drives me to ask this kind of qeustions...
Understood. We see it all the time with new adopters coming over from Windows. You'll notice there is no such thing as an anti-virus application (in any conventional sense) for Linux. There's a reason for that.

Enjoy carefree computing.

Actually, there are some very good antivirus programs for Linux. I run eset on one of my machines ( Love eset ) and there is Bitdefender, sophos, Avast and of course ClamAV.

I agree that *most* people dont need it.. however, there is concern for some people that are in hostile environments, dual boot windows, run windows and / or have a long history of windows files.

Example of this - I have a client that has years and years of emails and data from her clients... as well as some docs that were saved that were not legit. One of the paralegals that is helping her has a laptop running Mint and she comes into the office regularly. We setup eset on her machine and it has identified several legitimate problems it has found in those files - including several root kits. Probably would not be an issue on the mint laptop... but...;-/

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 9:55 pm**

CharlesV wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 9:36 pm
Example of this - I have a client that has years and years of emails and data from her clients... as well as some docs that were saved that were not legit. One of the paralegals that is helping her has a laptop running Mint and she comes into the office regularly. We setup eset on her machine and it has identified several legitimate problems it has found in those files - including several root kits. Probably would not be an issue on the mint laptop... but...;-/

Not to be argumentative, but those AV hits are on stuff found in the Windows file system, are they not? And the Mint laptop hasn't been compromised, has it? Point being, in conventional use even if malware is detected in a data set you're accessing, the threat of your Linux OS being pwned is minuscule.

I'm curious, are the AV applications mentioned able to clean/repair the malware found? In a previous life I had a pretty lucrative side gig cleaning up and repairing infested Windows machines. At the time, I never did find a Linux program that would do the job like the Windows based tools I used.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 11:08 pm**

I have had several "cleans" of email ( linux only, incoming emails ), and seen several 'cleans" of clients machines as well. No Windows involved on these, but I would agree that I dont believe they would amount to too much either.

I read weekly about issues coming down on linux machines, including getting ahold of machines... however no I have not seen anything get a grip yet.

I *have* seen bitdefender find and remove malware that was dropped in on google chrome.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2025 11:39 pm**

FullScale4Me wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:22 pm Check into the MX app User Installed Packages for capturing your apps and installing them on the new installation. It does have some limits:
Flatpacks - not covered

Apimage - not covered

SNAPS - not covered

Anything 'installed' via copying, ie, not through 'apt install <program_name>' or a process that spawns it.

Added:

Any apps installed via: Wine, WineTricks, PlayonLinux, Bottles, Lutris or Steam - not covered.

Posted: **Sat Apr 19, 2025 12:39 am**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 7:55 pm Thanks again for clarification DukeComposed.

So your advice for safely using Firefox for example for online banking is to upgrade to the newer MX OS version before it falls out of mainstream support?

So I misunderstood and the MX devs won't package new Firefox updates for the last two main MX OS releases? The updates will stop at june 26 for MX 23 except LTS for Kernel security stuff?

.......

There is some confusion here.

The MX packaging team is the one that packages Firefox,since Debian only provides Firefox-ESR, and the MX team have always continued to do so for the whole 5 years of normal+LTS life of the Debian base in question.

This is provided of course that the latest Firefox updates do not suddenly gain new dependencies that will conflict with the older Debian-base that the older MX is based on. And I am sure that if this suddenly is an issue, MX team will let everyone know.

And I agree that you are worrying too much. I wouldn't advise you to continue using EOL releases, but as long as an MX release is within the 5-year LTS period, there should not be a worry about security assuming you don't do foolish things yourself.

For your info, I run MX21 installs together with my MX23 ones on my PC, and MX21 is still receiving FIrefox updates. I just happened to be booted into MX21 XFCE today, and what do you know? Firefox updates! And google-chrome [from Google repo, and it still works]. And MX21 is also receiving the new MX tool, UEFI-manager, as well as fixes for the other MX Tools, 4 years into its release life.

Code: Select all

  full upgrade
  Reading package lists...
  Building dependency tree...
  Reading state information...
  Calculating upgrade...
  
  The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:

  [snip]

......

  The following NEW packages will be installed:
     uefi-manager (25.5.02)
  The following packages will be upgraded:
     cli-installer-mx (5.3 => 25.4.01)
     firefox (137.0~mozillabinaries-1mx21+2 => 137.0.2~mozillabinaries-1mx21+1)
     firefox-l10n-xpi-zh-tw (137.0~mozillabinaries-1mx21+1 => 137.0.2~mozillabinaries-1mx21+1)
     google-chrome-stable (135.0.7049.52-1 => 135.0.7049.95-1)
     libglib2.0-0 (2.66.8-1+deb11u5 => 2.66.8-1+deb11u6)
     libglib2.0-bin (2.66.8-1+deb11u5 => 2.66.8-1+deb11u6)
     libglib2.0-data (2.66.8-1+deb11u5 => 2.66.8-1+deb11u6)
     login (1:4.8.1-1 => 1:4.8.1-1+deb11u1)
     mx-boot-options (25.2.06 => 25.4.02)
     mx-bootrepair (24.4 => 25.4.01)
     mx-packageinstaller (25.3.02 => 25.5.01)
     mx-service-manager (24.3.02 => 25.4)
     mx-snapshot (25.2 => 25.4)
     passwd (1:4.8.1-1 => 1:4.8.1-1+deb11u1)
     wpasupplicant (2:2.9.0-21+deb11u2 => 2:2.9.0-21+deb11u3)
  15 upgraded, 1 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
  Need to get 197 MB of archives.
  After this operation, 556 kB of additional disk space will be used.

I'll be using MX21 until its EOL next year, in 2026. Same thing I've done for all MX releases since the first one, MX14.

Posted: **Sat Apr 19, 2025 1:17 am**

Thank you all again for your answers, especially the most recent one from asqwerth. That was "the" answer with the information I wanted. So 5 years per version are "fine".

Again: Thank you very much for answering an worrywart like myself.

I wish you all happy eastern! And an nice weekend. :-)

Posted: **Sat Apr 19, 2025 4:15 am**

FullScale4Me wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 11:39 pm
FullScale4Me wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:22 pm Check into the MX app User Installed Packages for capturing your apps and installing them on the new installation. It does have some limits:
Flatpacks - not covered

Apimage - not covered

SNAPS - not covered

Anything 'installed' via copying, ie, not through 'apt install <program_name>' or a process that spawns it.

Added:
Any apps installed via: Wine, WineTricks, PlayonLinux, Bottles, Lutris or Steam - not covered.

And Nix packages, and "./configure; make; make install" and "curl | sh", oh my!

Posted: **Sat Apr 19, 2025 6:17 am**

Noax

Maybe this link can also be useful:
https://endoflife.date/mxlinux

About updating and safety I don't believe there are any guarantees.
It is more about minimizing the risk.

For banking I have to recommend a full updated and fresh booted computer.
Maybe the most important is the Firefox settings, and also to keep an eye on they are not changed by updates.
And in general I believe, the closer you stay to the programs chosen by the MX team and install nothing else, the more sure you can be the developers can and will do their very best to protect you.
If you are lucky enough to have more than one computer it might feel good to keep one just for serious work and beside that to have one for update test and fun.
Wow... I just received an update for Firefox.. gotta go.! ;-)

Posted: **Sat Apr 19, 2025 12:36 pm**

Noax wrote: Fri Apr 18, 2025 5:35 pm But I am the type of guy who installs an completely new OS over the previous one and then installs the necessary software for printers, games etc.

I will simply back all data on my rusty ntfs hdd USB drive and copy them later back over.

I was too, and I won't be able to do this immediately on one of my laptops because I'll be installing a larger ssd because the current one is extremely small (~120GB), but I'm at least going to try (to see if I like it) and start installing the newest release beside the current/old installation - only on a sufficiently sized ssd - so that I can simply copy over some /home/user files from the existing/old installation, e.g. .mozilla, etc. Although I haven't done this yet.
========

Also, with a bigger ssd - or an external one, you may later consider a separate DATA partition, again with your common Documents, Downloads, Music, Pictures, Videos (and personally added ones) showing as symlinks that point to the actual content in your DATA folder. Don't touch the DATA partition during an install, and then simply recreate symbolic links to the existing directories in the DATA folder, i.e. Documents Downloads Music Pictures Videos which (again) are linked to the symlinks in the home folder.

Reason, redundantly - easier to retain data during reinstall, just ignore the DATA partition, only recreate the symlinks.

Cheers

MX Linux Forum

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