m_pav wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 10:08 pm
You might not want to put such faith in the USB Flash media because by default, most USB Flash drives are designed for BOT, not to be used in a real-time live system. BOT is an acronym for
Bulk
Only
Transport. If I were you. I'd be making a backup image of the USB drive quick smart after 6 months of use if the data contained therein is important to you.
A much better flash drive type for Live use is a drive manufactured to the USAP specification. UASP is an acronym for
USB
Attached
SCSI
Protocol and they have supremely better capabilities than BOT drives because they have a real controller, more in line with, though not the same as, that of a proper fixed disk like a HDD or an SSD. Furthermore, they are magnitudes of scale faster than a regular BOT drive.
Yes Mike, I completely agree with you, as long as
all components in the the chain support UASP, e.g. the USB device, the host PC hw (controllers) and its firmware, and the sw drivers in the OS. Otherwise you won't get the benefits of using UAS Protocol.
In my case:
Code: Select all
$ lsusb -v | grep "Lexar"
Bus 004 Device 002: ID 05dc:a838 Lexar Media, Inc. JumpDrive Tough
idVendor 0x05dc Lexar Media, Inc
$ lsmod | grep uas
squashfs 65536 1
zstd_decompress 86016 1 squashfs
uas 32768 0
usb_storage 81920 2 uas
scsi_mod 262144 6 sd_mod,usb_storage,uas,libata,sg,sr_mod
usbcore 315392 7 xhci_hcd,ehci_pci,usbhid,usb_storage,ehci_hcd,xhci_pci,ua
The code above shows my Lexar USB flash drive where multi boot Ventoy with several Linux flavors is installed. And it shows this flash drive supports UASP.
But:
Code: Select all
$ lsusb
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 8087:8000 Intel Corp.
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Bus 001 Device 002: ID 8087:8008 Intel Corp.
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Bus 004 Device 002: ID 05dc:a838 Lexar Media, Inc. JumpDrive Tough
Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0003 Linux Foundation 3.0 root hub
Bus 003 Device 002: ID 046d:c52b Logitech, Inc. Unifying Receiver
Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hu
$ lsusb -t
/: Bus 04.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 5000M
|__ Port 2: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Mass Storage, Driver=usb-storage, 5000M
/: Bus 03.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/10p, 480M
|__ Port 3: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 12M
|__ Port 3: Dev 2, If 1, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 12M
|__ Port 3: Dev 2, If 2, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 12M
/: Bus 02.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=ehci-pci/2p, 480M
|__ Port 1: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Hub, Driver=hub/6p, 480M
/: Bus 01.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=ehci-pci/2p, 480M
|__ Port 1: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Hub, Driver=hub/4p, 480
$ lspci
...
00:14.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation 8 Series/C220 Series Chipset Family USB xHCI (rev 05)
...
00:1a.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation 8 Series/C220 Series Chipset Family USB EHCI #2 (rev 05)
...
00:1d.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation 8 Series/C220 Series Chipset Family USB EHCI #1 (rev 05)
...
00:1f.2 SATA controller: Intel Corporation 8 Series/C220 Series Chipset Family 6-port SATA Controller 1 [AHCI mode] (rev 05)
$ lsusb -v -d 05dc:a838
Bus 004 Device 002: ID 05dc:a838 Lexar Media, Inc. JumpDrive Tough
Couldn't open device, some information will be missing
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 3.00
bDeviceClass 0
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 9
idVendor 0x05dc Lexar Media, Inc.
idProduct 0xa838 JumpDrive Tough
bcdDevice 11.00
iManufacturer 1
iProduct 2
iSerial 3
bNumConfigurations 1
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 0x002c
bNumInterfaces 1
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0x80
(Bus Powered)
MaxPower 504mA
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 8 Mass Storage
bInterfaceSubClass 6 SCSI
bInterfaceProtocol 80 Bulk-Only
iInterface 0
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x01 EP 1 OUT
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0400 1x 1024 bytes
bInterval 0
bMaxBurst 8
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x82 EP 2 IN
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0400 1x 1024 bytes
bInterval 0
bMaxBurst 8
demo@mx1:/home
$ lsusb -v -d 05dc:a838 | grep bInterfaceProtocol
Couldn't open device, some information will be missing
bInterfaceProtocol 80 Bulk-Only
In the code above you can see my Lexar flash drive is at Bus 04 Port 2 Driver=usb-storage
instead of uas, so it (the Bus device) does
not support uas.
Besides, notice that the only bInterfaceProtocol line value listed is 80 Bulk-Only
instead of bInterfaceProtocol 98. bInterfaceProtocol 98 indicates the device supports the protocol required for UAS. If you see a bInterfaceProtocol 98 line, it means a UASP-configured device.
From what I read, you need 3 components to get UASP:
OS Support: Windows 8, Windows 10, Linux
USB controller support: Any USB 2 or 3+ interface that doesn't have UASP blacklisted (*).
UASP ready peripherals: UASP standards solidified near the end of USB 3.0 development so most USB 3.0 storage products are not UASP compatible.
(*) Some buggy chips were produced thus some products claiming UASP support have been blacklisted. Hopefully most USB 3.1 products will include UASP support.
Bottom line: speed is not a problem, and reliability is within my expectation for the time being. Human error was a factor in my issue.
See further details
here and
here.
Like others here, I can't emphasise enough how great our Live system is when used from a fully featured Live USB. I too use Ventoy when I only need a limited feature set, but you really can't go past a full featured Live ISO, there is so much more we have to offer that Ventoy simply can not provide.
I also fully agree with your statement above, Mike. The only reason I'm using Ventoy is because I am learning and familiarizing myself with the Linux family, and for me at least it is very convenient to play around and test the different flavors without the need to replace several USB flash drives every now and then, including being able to carry along with me wherever I go. No critical and / or classified documents are being stored on it. Just enjoying and having fun while learning.
I'm leaning to install a full blown MX Linux on both my DT and LT. When that happens, I sure will also have handy with me a Live USB MX Linux flash drive. But as the hw are
jurassic, no expectations in regards to UASP.
Thank you for your heads up, MIke.