Anyone using a Sandisk G-Drive with MX?

[AVLinux]

Hi,

Looking for a heavy duty USB-C multi TB archiving solution for many years of Audio Recordings and Video editing projects.

I've done some reading on Sandisk G-Drives which are seemingly geared and formatted for Macs but according to the docs can be formatted for Windows. The first assumption is "ahh filesystem stuff, Works with Windows will work with Linux!" I have been bitten by such blind confidence before.. My main concern is if there is some onboard controller chip that isn't supported, I realize the drive media itself wouldn't be an issue.

Anyone here using these types of drives professionally who can comment on their compatibility with Linux? Sandisk's official party line for this product is "We don't support Linux"

[CharlesV]

This is a very interesting subject. (No, I do not use Sandisk G-Drives btw )

When you look up specs on ssd's they are typically four to six specifics of the drive that really matter:
- speed
- TBW (Terabytes Written )
- Warranty
- MTBF ( Mean Time Between Failure)
- Type of NAND technology ( TLC is pretty much what we have now.. some other variants, but they are still pretty high $ and harder to get )
- Capacity of use - Capacity of use is where the drive return starts to diminish at ( Example: a disk that is 50% used will last FAR longer than a disk that is at 80 of 90% used! )

How ssd's are used is really the most critical feature, but long term storage can be in trouble with most if they are not powered up "once in a while" .. At the same time, constant writing on them is where they are not too tolerable either.



In looking up the Sandisk G-Drive, The TBW is pretty high - higher than anything I have ever seen ( 11,000 TBw ) almost too high to be true. But, their warranty is HALF that of some Samsung drives. As with a lot of this the devil is in the details! That calculation of 11,000 is derived from :
- KiB random write workload over five years. (7.68TB x 0.8 DWPD x 365 Days x 5 years = 11,212.

https://documents.westerndigital.com/co ... io-ssd.pdf


I am not really sure that is a bonified valid test and result. if it is... then that is one hell of a drive!

Personally, I have had extremely good usage from samsung Evo 840's and a few others. The 840 line is a 10 year warranty drive, and I have four machines put into service in 2010 that were built on RAID0 using twin samsung that are still running 14 years later with ZERO glitches!

And while I swear by samsung EVO's, I have had two 870 Evo's blow on me - replaced with no questions asked - one at 4 years of a 5 year life and one at 2 years of a five year life. ( Both in RAID1 )

When we talk about Samsung Evo's.. I have put hundreds into use and had exactly 2 fail... I will take those odds any day! And samsung EVO's are amazingly fast too.

https://semiconductor.samsung.com/consu ... /warranty/


I also really like the Western Digital Black nvme series. With 5 year warranties, up to 7K read / write performance, and 4,800 TBW on some of their drives... they are 'no brainier' for inside a computer imo.

If you put one of these NVME SSd drives in a GOOD enclosure... use it to write too and dont leave it on all the time, then you save yourself from heavy writing, high / constant temperature. And if you stay below a 65% capacity mark, and start the drive up every year... then you have the potential for an 8 to 14 year drive life. ( and probably quite a bit longer! )

Interestingly.. for ALL of these drives... the MTBF is "a standard" of "2 million hours" ( 32.5 years )


And if you REALLY want to store for "A long time" ... then check out the ISO / IEC 16963: 2017 standards!

https://www.iso.org/standard/71159.html

THE Standard ...
Archival-grade optical discs, such as M-DISC
https://www.verbatim.com/subcat/optical-media/m-disc/

https://www.howtogeek.com/858426/whats- ... centuries/

[CharlesV]

Some External nvme enclosures...

I have two of these:
https://www.amazon.com/Sabrent-Type-C-T ... B08RVC6F9Y
__and one of these
https://www.amazon.com/SSK-Aluminum-Enc ... B07MNFH1PX

Both are stellar! Top speeds, dissipate heat well and VERY nice to work with.


And just to plug SSK a little... I have two of these drives I use ALL the time and they are SWEET! I dont know if I would plan on using them for long term storage... but for everyday use these rock! (AND they are both C and USB 3 as well, so they serve me VERY well on various machines too!

https://www.amazon.com/SSK-External-Sto ... B0C365PLCC
__ and
https://www.amazon.com/SSK-External-iPh ... 48X93?th=1

[CharlesV]

Slightly off topic... but kind of not as same subject... I am currently working with an Artist that has YEARS of data on Syquest disks. ( 63 disks total)

It has taken me weeks to get all the right SCSI controller, cables, etc so that I can read the drive and copy data off. (I used to have all that scsi stuff.. but sold it off years and years ago as "will never need it again" .. uh huh.. I know better!)

My deliverables back to her are:
1 - SSK 1tb pocket drive ( listed previously ) , so she can easily browse the data, and
1 - WD Black 1tb NVME in a Sabrent enclosure for long term storage. ( also listed earlier )
1 - Blue-Ray disk ( possibly two) containing all the data for a third copy.

[figueroa]

For archiving purposes, a better value might be a pair of large traditional hard drives. I wouldn't waste money on solid state drives for bulk storage.

[django013]

How ssd's are used is really the most critical feature, but long term storage can be in trouble with most if they are not powered up "once in a while" .

Do you have any background informations about that?

I know, time without power is an issue of rotating harddisks, but didn't know, that its an issue for ssd too.
I use ssd for backup of audio/video for about 5 years - and use it in the manner: write once and power on for read when needed.
No issues til now - even with long time unpowered.
My server with raid systems of rotating harddisks had several issues on staying unpowered for a while.

[AVLinux]

Thanks for all the info, giving me lots to think about!

I actually have an NVMe enclosure, I recently bought a cheap Thinkpad when a local Uni was selling off their office machines and I swapped out the 256Gb NVMe it came with a larger one, but 256Gb doesn't store much, even a multitrack Ardour session can easily be 5Gb or more and NVMe seems like a better format for something constantly being hotplugged to work off of than to simply hold data. As it happens I do have a MDisk compatible Bluray Burner but archiving to burnable media even if it will easily outlive me seems like it will be locked out in a few years already because the BD-R drives will disappear ie your SCSI situation all over again except with a hundredfold more data. Already it's not like there are more than just a few brands of Bluray burners on Amazon and the MDisk media is worth gold for not a lot of storage. I'm thinking like 20Tb of storage for current and future archiving which is why the G Drives were appealing... Old school SATA HDD's may actually be the way to go but future proofed enclosures are another consideration..

Maybe I should just delete it all... as the Buddhists say "to cling is to suffer"

[CharlesV]

How ssd's are used is really the most critical feature, but long term storage can be in trouble with most if they are not powered up "once in a while" .

Do you have any background informations about that?

I know, time without power is an issue of rotating harddisks, but didn't know, that its an issue for ssd too.
I use ssd for backup of audio/video for about 5 years - and use it in the manner: write once and power on for read when needed.
No issues til now - even with long time unpowered.
My server with raid systems of rotating harddisks had several issues on staying unpowered for a while.

While this has been pushed around for years in all directions, the answer is yes it is a proven fact of nand technology. Now, it HAS gotten a lot better, but it is still a thing:

One of the best reads on this is here - and remember TLC is MOST of the SSD tech on the market at this time!
( The average data retention period without power is between 1 to 3 years. )
https://storedbits.com/how-do-ssds-reta ... out-power/

A number of papers and studies here:
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=nand+technolo ... 6-1&ia=web

A few that I found on a quick search .
https://www.anandtech.com/show/9248/the ... -retention
https://storedbits.com/ssd-data-retenti ... out-power/
https://robots.net/tech/how-long-can-ss ... out-power/

[CharlesV]

Thanks for all the info, giving me lots to think about!

I actually have an NVMe enclosure, I recently bought a cheap Thinkpad when a local Uni was selling off their office machines and I swapped out the 256Gb NVMe it came with a larger one, but 256Gb doesn't store much, even a multitrack Ardour session can easily be 5Gb or more and NVMe seems like a better format for something constantly being hotplugged to work off of than to simply hold data. As it happens I do have a MDisk compatible Bluray Burner but archiving to burnable media even if it will easily outlive me seems like it will be locked out in a few years already because the BD-R drives will disappear ie your SCSI situation all over again except with a hundredfold more data. Already it's not like there are more than just a few brands of Bluray burners on Amazon and the MDisk media is worth gold for not a lot of storage. I'm thinking like 20Tb of storage for current and future archiving which is why the G Drives were appealing... Old school SATA HDD's may actually be the way to go but future proofed enclosures are another consideration..

Maybe I should just delete it all... as the Buddhists say "to cling is to suffer"

lol.. Ya..all this is very interesting imo as there *still* is no direct, long term storage that doesnt have some type of issue. Honestly, I think SSD is one of the best - just has to be powered up once in a while. Of course, saying this ... I fired up an HD from 2010 that has been sitting on a shelf for nearly 14 years... (written too as a backup and then set on a shelf) and had zero issues getting data off.

[DukeComposed]

How ssd's are used is really the most critical feature, but long term storage can be in trouble with most if they are not powered up "once in a while" .

Do you have any background informations about that?

I know, time without power is an issue of rotating harddisks, but didn't know, that its an issue for ssd too.

This is commonly spoken of in storage nerd circles. AnandTech has a fairly comprehensive breakdown of the situation without getting too too academic. The short version is that NAND flash memory works a little like an alarm clock: as long as it's plugged in and the battery is good, everything's fine. When the battery dies, the alarm clock loses the time and starts flashing "12:00". There are environmental factors involved with SSD drives that are less important when dealing with older magnetic media: warm platters don't lose their charge much faster than cold platters do.