The future of Xfce

[freemedia2018]

Why do we make so much out of seemingly trivial things (in retrospect, anyway) -- but, the Grub is accepted without complaint?

thankfully, sometimes these things turn out to be no big deal. i dont know if this is one of those, i think people had some valid complaints, but youll always have some people who are happy and some who are unhappy. often the reason for the change is actually unnecessary and avoidable-- even reasonably so. sometimes the intentions are good-- some changes really are almost indisputably excellent.

grub(2, i assume you mean) wasnt accepted without complaint though. they eventually shut us up, if only by giving us something else to dislike more. another thing is, if you really hate grub you can run mx from grub4dos instead, or even syslinux if you want to do some fancy footwork. you still have choices there-- if you have uefi, it may make a few of those for you though.

[elementaryOX]

What is wrong with CSD? Looks great! More modern. The only thing I would not loose is the whisker menu:-) This is, why I am on MX-Linux.
What are the pros and cons? Please no religious debate - like there is on systemd :-)

[imschmeg]

What is wrong with CSD? Looks great! More modern. The only thing I would not loose is the whisker menu:-) This is, why I am on MX-Linux.
What are the pros and cons? Please no religious debate - like there is on systemd :-)

See:
viewtopic.php?f=93&t=56087&start=20#p558779

[elementaryOX]

The 'normal' user is a strange spezies. He wants that things (MX-Linux and Xfce also) grew better everyday - but he dislikes changes :-)

[Mauser]

What is wrong with CSD? Looks great! More modern. The only thing I would not loose is the whisker menu:-) This is, why I am on MX-Linux.
What are the pros and cons? Please no religious debate - like there is on systemd :-)

What is wrong with CSD? It looks like Gnome. If I want Gnome I would use Gnome instead of Xfce. If CSD was optional it wouldn't be an issue because you then have a choice to use what you like.

I'm appreciating all the comments, but I hear a lot of incessant whining about changes to things they use but neither develop or pay for. Why not just be a lot more appreciative for the developers who keep XFCE stable, compatible, and robust in a changing world. I like the snails pace development of XFCE, and how they have successfully avoided feature creep and change for the sake of change.

Likewise, I quite like the slower development pace of LXDE, and I think the rumors of its demise are not panning out. LXQt, on the other hand seems to be perennially unusable as a primary desktop.

Now that I know more, I'm not worried about changes to XFCE.

Your comments show the opposite of appreciating all the comments by showing lack of manners by attacking anyone that are not a developers or pay for Xfce and that people are not allowed to voice opinions on it thinking you are better than everyone else. It's not whining, it's people voicing their opinion of the idea of Xfce developers going with CSD by making it look like Gnome. Many people including myself appreciate the work that the Xfce developers have done so far, but many people including myself feel that changing to CSD is not a good idea by creating another Gnome. Only time will tell what the end result and hope that the Xfce developers will change their minds by not going with CSD. There are other alternatives if they go through with implementing CSD.

[SwampRabbit]

Let’s all remain civil and stay on topic please.

[freemedia2018]

one of the reasons people use xfce (including me, when ive used it) is that they DONT want one of the fad-chasing desktops.

xfce is probably the most stable one. if they start changing, there are basically zero options for this particular feature-- xfce was the last option that regard.

i dont hate lxqt but i dont love it-- i liked lxde more. oh well.

xfce is reliable. this change could make it less reliable.

having to constantly explain why stability is a desired feature, to people who get bored and seek entertainment (rather than reliability, stability or familiarity) in their desktop design, is weird. you would think that isnt too hard a preference to understand, but other people want what they want. they dont understand why you would want what YOU want. you explain, and its still a mystery to them. go figure.

[imschmeg]

one of the reasons people use xfce (including me, when ive used it) is that they DONT want one of the fad-chasing desktops.

xfce is probably the most stable one. if they start changing, there are basically zero options for this particular feature-- xfce was the last option that regard.

Someone brought up Mate, which I had used once. I think it qualifies as having "won't chase fads" as part of its manifesto. I am tempted to try it out again, see if can get a dark theme that I like.

Right now, Xfce has a very nice combination of things I haven't had all at once before. The ability to customize titlebars and borders to my liking is still pretty common, especially among lighter weight WMs like fluxbox or icewm. But getting good consistent dark themes on those lighter WMs is hard - I haven't had much luck across the board. Closest on MX fluxbox, but still not as good as standard MX Xfce. I am also a big fan of the Papirus icon theme due to its lack of gradients and shadows (which reduce contrast) and simple but distinct coloration (which enhance contrast), yet still looks appealing. The combination of these helped attract me to MX, along with the awesome MX toolset, of course.

As for those "religious" critics of CSD: I am mostly afraid of creeping-Gnomism, where many other WM and DE dev teams move in the CSD direction for various reasons, and then drop the ability to disable it because why bother maintaining that. As the "religious" crowd has much larger numbers than the "please keep a high contrast GUI option that doesn't suck" crowd, they're right now my allies in the battle to prevent creeping-Gnomism from taking over.

[figueroa]

i dont hate lxqt but i dont love it-- i liked lxde more. oh well.

I'm sorry, but your posts have much the same rude tone of some of the rants in the XFCE forums. That tone is not very consistent with what is usually read here in the MX forum. Even so, I'm glad for the thread here and all the posts here about the XFCE roadmap. I've learned things.

One can still use LXDE. I've been using LXDE with it's default WM OpenBox for about 10 years on my main desktop under Gentoo and I'm still loving it. But I'm also happy with MX and it's XFCE DE, and don't agree with those who are insisting that CSD will be the end of the world.

[figueroa]

It's not whining, it's people voicing their opinion of the idea of Xfce developers going with CSD by making it look like Gnome. Many people including myself appreciate the work that the Xfce developers have done so far, but many people including myself feel that changing to CSD is not a good idea by creating another Gnome.

You should surely be expressing those opinions over at the XFCE forums where they may be useful. I've learned a lot from reading this thread. The amount of anxiety expressed (which I depicted as whining) doesn't seem appropriate to whether CSD is or isn't in XFCE's future.

Many users don't like change. I don't like change. But here I am using GRUB2 and a modern kernel having allowed myself to be dragged into the future, and looking back, most of it wasn't too bad. It was mostly on me. I had to learn how to cope with new things.