Windows 7 End of Life

Message
Author
User avatar
junoluna
Posts: 522
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2019 11:53 pm

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#31 Post by junoluna »

rapit wrote: Fri Jan 03, 2020 1:39 am

the only problem I'm having now is that some of the applications in the mxlinux package installer can't be installed. Also I am still looking for a solution for xrdp.
which apps?

do a thread
i am sure the clever types will help you get them installed

User avatar
Oli
Posts: 160
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2019 6:22 pm

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#32 Post by Oli »

I started to experiment with Linux distros 1-2 years ago. In my personal environment nobody uses Linux, not one. Most people don't know what it is.

One of my earliest attempts was to install Lubuntu, Mint and Manjaro on an old Fujitsu-Siemens Amilo Pro V3515 Laptop with VIA graphics chipset VN896.
Man... that was a consistent pain.

But despite all setbacks the fast development and increasing number of user-friendly Linux distributions kept my attentions. Then, one day I installed MX-18 on my HP 6710b Laptop.
First I received a lot of error messages during the boot process. But by using the "video=SVIDEO-1:d" option they were all blown off and this age-old pal ran like hell.
I upgraded to 4 GB RAM placed a T9300 cpu and a SSD. What a pleasant experience!

After this breakthrough I installed MX on an old ASRock G41M-S3 with an E6300 DualCore overclocked @ 3,5 GHz. - Direct hit!
At present, we have 4 devices running with MX-19 at home. Two of them are sharing a dual boot with Windows 7 without probs.

And no, I will definitely not switch to Windows 10. I'll keep Windows 7 for the next 2-3 years on the latest update and with a recent Firefox browser.
For special purposes like a complete firmware recovery of the router this is irreplaceable. In some rare cases you have to have the continuing ability to run an .exe file.

In 2-3 years when there are no Firefox updates available anymore I'll cut the internet connection in Windows 7. At that time there will be even more options.
So far my personal strategy.

Cheers

User avatar
Electroguard
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:07 pm

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#33 Post by Electroguard »

How to continue using Win7 safely while migrating to linux?

Firstly, take a hdd clone of your existing Windows and put that to one side, then do any changes to the clone… knowing you always have the original to return to if necessary.
I bought a USB3 dual SATA hdd docking bay for about 25 quid off Aliexpress, plus a 2TB hdd for about 60. Without using USB it allows stand-alone cloning of 1 drive to another (takes about 5 hours for 2TB). With USB it allows USB3 computer access to 1 or 2 SATA HDDs or SSDs.


Secondly, end of Win7 support only causes Win7 to become more vulnerable if it is accessing the internet. So if your 'must have' Windows apps do not require internet access, don't connect it to the internet - simply use an inherently safer linux for all internet browsing and uploads/downloads.

If you can't avoid going online with Win7, make sure to use a good VPN, firewall, and antivirus…
and only visit essential URLs... aimless surfing with vulnerabilities in a sea of sharks is asking for trouble.
And don't forget to turn off Windows automatic updates, cos nothing good can come of it!


Thirdly, if you really want to escape your Windows addiction you need a migration strategy.
My strategy was to reduce the cloned Win7 partition to minimal, then add a 120Gbn MX19 dual boot partition, and use the remainder as an NTFS data partition (if you use something other than MX you may also need to create a swap partition).
Install the dual-boot MX, plus VMware Workstation 15.5 - which allows 30 day trial period, but it also installs VMplayer as well anyway which does not expire (Workstation allows multiple virtual machines to be running, whereas VMplayer only runs 1 vm at a time).
It must be at least VMware 15.5 to work as host on the latest linux's and to allow latest linux's as vm clients. Note that for VMware on MX you will also need to add the vmmon tweaks to rc.local (search the forum).

You could now create a new Win7 virtual machine if you wished… and you could use the licence key from the original because you are never going to have both running at the same time.
You can continue to use the original Win7 for as long as necessary, but the long term aim is to migrate as much as possible to MX. So rather than continue using your original Win7, better to install any indispensable Win7 apps onto a new Win7 virtual machine.

At your leisure you can pick a Win7 app that you use and try to find an MX alternative (it doesn't just have to be MX of course, because you could run other virtual machine OS's which may offer their own unique advantages).

If you cannot find a linux alternative (yet) then install that indispensable windows app to your new Win7 vm.
As time goes by you will migrate many apps to linux alternatives, and build up a minimal Win7 vm of your windows indispensables… so eventually you will be able to do without the original Win7 completely, even though it will always still be available and untouched just in case.


Running Win7 in a vm offers several advantages…

Easy to turn off guest internet access.
Easy for vm guest to share/transfer files and folders with vm host.
Easy to take snapshots as backups, or copy the entire vm to run elsewhere, or for safe keeping.
Easy to relocate clients to other computers (VMware hosts package their specific hardware drivers into generic vm client drivers).
Easy to run other client VM's to benefit from other features that MX may not have.
Easy to relocate vm clients to VMware running on different OS's.


The combination of MX and virtual machines provides for a very robust, convenient, and simple to use system.
I'm an XP survivor, and now a Win7 survivor, but I won't be suffering any other MS disasters (have even moved from Skype to Viber).
Win 10 is MS slavery, but Win8.1 could be a short term alternative, either to run some windows indispensables, or to use as a VMware host.
It would only be a short-term stop-gap because Win8 users will also inevitably be dumped so that MS can force users to pay for Win10, and eventually all the Win10 users will be similarly dumped to upgrade to a successor. That's the dark shadow cast by any business model which profits at the detriment of its tied customer base… and is the original reason I chose MX Linux rather than the more ubiquitous Ubuntu or its Mint derivative... and am very pleased I did.

User avatar
Eadwine Rose
Administrator
Posts: 14492
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 2:10 am

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#34 Post by Eadwine Rose »

Electroguard wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:36 am How to continue using Win7 safely while migrating to linux?
1. Pull out ethernet cable / disconnect wifi.
2. Boot into windows.

Done.
MX-23.6_x64 July 31 2023 * 6.1.0-35amd64 ext4 Xfce 4.20.0 * 8-core AMD Ryzen 7 2700
Asus TUF B450-Plus Gaming UEFI * Asus GTX 1050 Ti Nvidia 535.247.01 * 2x16Gb DDR4 2666 Kingston HyperX Predator
Samsung 870EVO * Samsung S24D330 & P2250 * HP Envy 5030

User avatar
Oli
Posts: 160
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2019 6:22 pm

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#35 Post by Oli »

:biggrin:

User avatar
Frank_v7
Posts: 29
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:55 am

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#36 Post by Frank_v7 »

Eadwine Rose wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:54 am
Electroguard wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:36 am How to continue using Win7 safely while migrating to linux?
1. Pull out ethernet cable / disconnect wifi.
2. Boot into windows.

Done.
LMAO! :number1:

bscho

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#37 Post by bscho »

I have destroyed one SSD drive trying to dual boot with MX. It is a great distro and I have made a Super Windows 10 version of it. Just looks like Windows 10.

Unlike Mint and Peppermint this needs really careful following of the installation I have now put it it on three machines and it has taken me all yesterday though I wrote a very careful procedure for you to follow. See ginamiller.co.uk/MXsuper.php.

I am now using it on a HDD with now 4 operating systems a quadruple boot. I had to add an extra operating system just to fix the install problem as at the end of the install of MX it said Sorry you have no Grub you are on your own. I had to use Supergrub2 and an update grub on all the partitoions but still could not recover the grub so finally I installed I had to use Gparted and resize another Linux Mint 19.2 partition to get 150 Gb and installed another Linux Mint 19.2 ii found all the other operating systems and installed to grub OK.

My advice is you back up all your files on a USB or another external drive before attempting this.

The problem is the installer allows you to partition using Gparted to make space. But you also have to format that space as ext4 other distros allow you to install unallocated. This distro does not. You must memorize the partition position /dev/sda2 in your case perhaps. Then you have to select the third button saying Custom Install on Existing Partitions to choose where you want to put the install however it opts to install on your sda1 if you only have Windows 7 and that is where your Windows 7 is. You need to change this to sda2 or where you have made the partition. When you click NEXT another screen is very confusing it says using vfat I changed this one time do not do it.

Then watch out for another problem when you get to the name and passwords click the button show passwords then you have to enter four this is the only distro I have found that does that. If you do not enter them correctly the next screen will say wrong password and will not allow you to fix then and in my case rotates forever. I do not believe I entered the wrong ones but never did select view as I expect a checker at this point and there must not be one.

I like this distro as the Libreoffice is much improved and It has the latest Gimp2.10 unlike all the other distro still using 2.08/ Then Linux Mint 19.3 have left it out as well as VLC and left a bug so you cannot install it again. Use Linux Mint 19.2 if you want to go this route.

Let me know how you get on.

User avatar
JayM
Posts: 6796
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:47 am

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#38 Post by JayM »

bscho wrote: Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:01 am I have destroyed one SSD drive trying to dual boot with MX.
How did you manage to destroy a drive by installing MX as a dual-boot system? Try as I might I have never managed to destroy my hardware by installing a Linux distro.
Unlike Mint and Peppermint this needs really careful following of the installation I have now put it it on three machines and it has taken me all yesterday though I wrote a very careful procedure for you to follow. See ginamiller.co.uk/MXsuper.php.
I recommend following the pre-installation and installation instructions given in the MX manual. They're very detailed and cover almost every possible installation scenario. Your instructions completely bypass the live persistent USB capabilities of MX and don't even go into installing on systems that use UEFI. I should think people are better off following the official installation instructions from the MX developers rather than those on an unknown person's website. Don't you agree?
I am now using it on a HDD with now 4 operating systems a quadruple boot. I had to add an extra operating system just to fix the install problem as at the end of the install of MX it said Sorry you have no Grub you are on your own. I had to use Supergrub2 and an update grub on all the partitoions but still could not recover the grub so finally I installed I had to use Gparted and resize another Linux Mint 19.2 partition to get 150 Gb and installed another Linux Mint 19.2 ii found all the other operating systems and installed to grub OK.
The MX installer doesn't say anything about grub being missing. It's entirely possible to install MX without installing its grub, and the installation will quite happily complete without it. Then if you already have another distro installed along with its grub just boot into it and run update-grub as su or sudo in a terminal for it to detect and add MX to its boot menu. Bingo, all done.

It sounds like you installed MX's grub to the wrong location so when you rebooted after the installation your system couldn't find the bootloader. Perhaps you also changed the order of bootable devices in your BIOS settings? If you installed MX on sdb, installed its grub to sda, then made sdb's drive the default boot drive there would be no bootloader on that drive and you'd be unable to boot. But as I said, if you already boot using a different distro's grub you can use it to boot MX without installing grub again or changing the boot order in BIOS.
My advice is you back up all your files on a USB or another external drive before attempting this.
I heartily agree! People should be doing regular backups anyway but having everything backed up is especially important when you're going to be repartitioning and installing another OS. In any event it gives you peace of mind.
The problem is the installer allows you to partition using Gparted to make space. But you also have to format that space as ext4 other distros allow you to install unallocated. This distro does not. You must memorize the partition position /dev/sda2 in your case perhaps. Then you have to select the third button saying Custom Install on Existing Partitions to choose where you want to put the install however it opts to install on your sda1 if you only have Windows 7 and that is where your Windows 7 is. You need to change this to sda2 or where you have made the partition. When you click NEXT another screen is very confusing it says using vfat I changed this one time do not do it.
There are only two radio buttons on that screen, auto-install using entire disk and custom install using existing partitions. The second is the default.

Yes, you have to be careful which drive and partitions you select to install MX to, just as you do with all distro and with Windowss, to avoid installing over the top of something else that you wanted to keep. It helps to properly label all of your partitions so it's easier to tell what's what.
Then watch out for another problem when you get to the name and passwords click the button show passwords then you have to enter four this is the only distro I have found that does that. If you do not enter them correctly the next screen will say wrong password and will not allow you to fix then and in my case rotates forever. I do not believe I entered the wrong ones but never did select view as I expect a checker at this point and there must not be one.

I don't know what installer you're using but that's not the way the MX installer works, unless perhaps you're installing a very old version of MX? First, you have to enter two passwords not four, one for the default user account that you create during installation and one for root, and enter each one again to verify that you didn't mistype either of them. Every other distro's installer also requires passwords be typed twice during installation, though some distros don't prompt you to enter a root password as they do everything using sudo. Second, there isn't a "wrong password" message on the next screen. When retyping each password to verify it the password fields turn red until the two match, then they turn green, unless you're somehow using an old version of the installer that does things differently (in which case you should update the minstall package when running a live session after booting from the MX USB stick prior to installing MX.)

By the way, you can click the back button in the installer and double-check all of your choices prior to letting it finalize the installation, although by the time you get to the screen where you set up the user and root accounts it's already erased the selected partitions and is overwriting them. That's why there's a confirmation pop-up after you've selected your installation location that you have to click OK on before you can continue.
Last edited by JayM on Mon Jan 20, 2020 5:46 am, edited 3 times in total.
Please read the Forum Rules, How To Ask For Help, How to Break Your System and Don't Break Debian. Always include your full Quick System Info (QSI) with each and every new help request.

User avatar
asqwerth
Developer
Posts: 7821
Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 5:37 am

Re: Windows 7 End of Life

#39 Post by asqwerth »

Mint and Peppermint are both Ubuntu-based, and it's true that the Ubuntu family of distros only ask for the sudo (user) password for administration, and no root password, during installation. But it's wrong to extrapolate from these 2 and say " this is the only distro I have found that does that".

Debian asks for root and user passwords, and MX, being based on Debian does so. Some other Debian-based distros may chose to only use user password (I believe Bunsenlabs), but that's the devs' choice. I know Kanotix asks for both root and user during installation.

IIRC, distros using the Calamares installer (e.g. Manjaro) have a choice during installation to have separate root and user passwords or just user, but the choice is still there for separate root and user passwords. Sabayon, PCLinuxOS and Void Linux ask for root and user (for these 3, I use root (su) for administrative tasks; sudo is not enabled by default). I think Fedora does ask for root and user during installation as well but I can't recall offhand because sudo can be used for admin tasks and that's what I use.
Desktop: Intel i5-4460, 16GB RAM, Intel integrated graphics
Clevo N130WU-based Ultrabook: Intel i7-8550U (Kaby Lake R), 16GB RAM, Intel integrated graphics (UEFI)
ASUS X42D laptop: AMD Phenom II, 6GB RAM, Mobility Radeon HD 5400

Post Reply

Return to “General”