[solved] @#$%^*&! SystemD .. the snake strikes again

[richb]

I have unlocked the thread and edited out any references to an earlier era. Inflammatory comments do not belong on the Forum.

[Adrian]

I have unlocked the thread and edited out any references to an earlier era. Inflammatory comments do not belong on the Forum.

Title should probably be changed to "User shoots himself in the foot, blames systemd"

[turtlebay777]

Or 'in one era and out the other'. Or was that Richb's typo, era rather than error?

[Eadwine Rose]

The content deleted had an era in it. So his wording is correct.

[sunrat]

Title should probably be changed to "User shoots himself in the foot, blames systemd"

+1, except user blames systemD

Spelling

Yes, it is written systemd, not system D or System D, or even SystemD. And it isn't system d either. Why? Because it's a system daemon, and under Unix/Linux those are in lower case, and get suffixed with a lower case d. And since systemd manages the system, it's called systemd. It's that simple... The only situation where we find it OK to use an uppercase letter in the name (but don't like it either) is if you start a sentence with systemd.

From https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/

[AK-47]

Partially correct, sunrat! However Poettering's systemd was apparently a play on System D which is a way of responding to challenges that requires fast thinking, adaptability and ingenuity.

[Head_on_a_Stick]

To Head_on_a_Stick:
Nope I dont think I am the one who is confused here:

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$ cat /proc/cmdline
BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-4.19.0-5-amd64 root=UUID=c7eca528-9d40-4071-ab79-c273b78e0185 ro quiet
$ ls -l /sbin/init
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 44856 Apr 23 16:21 /sbin/init

Well APT was quite clear: you were booted with systemd running as PID1 when you produced the output in the OP. Things have obviously changed since then.

This is particularly amusing to me:

It refused to uninstall with

Code: Select all

apt uninstall systemd

but it was removed good with

Code: Select all

apt remove  --purge --auto-remove systemd

There should not be a difference, where the former throws an error and the latter just does it, but hey its systemd.

There is no such option as uninstall for the apt command... Who's confused now, eh?

And your second command breaks the desktop:

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empty@mx:~/Desktop
$ apt remove --simulate --purge --auto-remove systemd
NOTE: This is only a simulation!
      apt needs root privileges for real execution.
      Keep also in mind that locking is deactivated,
      so don't depend on the relevance to the real current situation!
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
The following packages will be REMOVED:
  apt-notifier* apt-transport-https* colord* fskbsetting* gazelle-installer-data-mx*
  gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0* gir1.2-polkit-1.0* gir1.2-soup-2.4* gir1.2-webkit2-4.0*
  grub-efi-amd64-bin* grub-efi-ia32-bin* gufw* gvfs* gvfs-backends* gvfs-daemons* gvfs-fuse*
  gvfs-libs* libatasmart4* libcolorhug2* libept1.5.0* libgdata-common* libgdata22* libgoa-1.0-0b*
  libgoa-1.0-common* libjansson4* libndp0* libnl-3-200* libnl-genl-3-200* libnm-glib-vpn1*
  libnm-glib4* libnm-gtk0* libnm-util2* libnm0* libnma0* liboauth0* libpam-systemd*
  libpolkit-agent-1-0* libpolkit-backend-1-0* libteamdctl0* libudisks2-0* mx-apps* mx-installer*
  mx-repo-list* mx-repo-manager* network-manager* network-manager-gnome*
  network-manager-openconnect* network-manager-openvpn* network-manager-openvpn-gnome*
  network-manager-pptp* network-manager-vpnc* policykit-1* policykit-1-gnome* pptp-linux*
  python-configobj* python-dbus* python-lxml* python-pyqt5* python-sip* synaptic* systemd*
  udisks2* unattended-upgrades* wpasupplicant*
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 64 to remove and 0 not upgraded.

It removes NetworkManager, gvfs (and udisks2), wpasupplicant and policykit-1. The user would then be unable to connect wirelessly, automount any devices or shutdown or restart from the GUI buttons.

[zimbodel]

To head on a stick..

# apt remove systemd
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package 'systemd' is not installed, so not removed
The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
linux-headers-4.19.0-0.bpo.6-amd64 linux-headers-4.19.0-0.bpo.6-common
linux-headers-4.9.0-11-amd64 linux-headers-4.9.0-11-common
linux-image-4.19.0-0.bpo.6-amd64 linux-image-4.9.0-11-amd64 linux-kbuild-4.9
Use 'apt autoremove' to remove them.
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 109 not upgraded.

Hello? do you see systemd installed here now ???
So how did I manage to uninstall it and run MX without it. ?
Clearly you dont know how to do it and believe it is impossible.
Sure it uninstalled all that AND systemD and then I just took note of what was uninstalled and reinstalled only those that doesnt have systemD as a dependency.
Why is it so hard for you to figure such a simple procedure out on your own? apparently you are still very confused or ?

To other comments:
I am glad systemD works for you.
MX18 works great now with systemD removed. I wish you could experience the difference then you would understand where I come from.
On my system and my experience what is going on, systemD is squarely at fault causing all the trouble.
If you want to sweep it under the rug, do so, but I am not going to tow the line and bend the truth to do so.

I tow the truth as far as I possibly can.
Try and smoke that for a change.

Anyway as you maybe did not notice. The problem is solved.
No reason for us to harp on sour grapes.

This thread is closed solved.
Move on.

Thanks

[sunrat]

No sour grapes, in fact I'm happy you have solved your issues. You must realise that an issue for you may be unique to you because of some configuration you changed or a combination of installed software that does not play well together. You must also realise that most people who use systemd do not have your issues so ranting that it is the root of evil does nothing to boost your credibility, nor does spelling it incorrectly.
It's refreshing though that you are one of the rare people who rant against systemd for practical reasons rather than philosophical ones.

[asqwerth]

...The problem is solved.....

For now.

That is because you have just manually weeded out all the systemd-related packages, as is your right and your choice.

...MX18 without systemD is just downright awesome. I have never had such a great system and I cannot state it enough.
I will now attempt to hard pin systemD to be banned from being installed\ as it always creeps past never mind how well you take care.

Once pinning works it will be absolutely unparalleled system....

I'm happy you are happy with MX running without any systemd-related packages on it. I hope you are able to fully banish systemd-related packages with your hard pinning.

But please do not issue another complaint post if you find that despite your efforts, you still have to carry out another systemd-removal exercise in future when more updates drop.

MX was made to boot into sysvinit by default, but not to be completely free of systemd-related packages by default. So you may have to expend the effort every once in a while to clear your garden. That is the potential consequence if you want to run MX your way.